Time to Move On
Author: flowrite
Posted: Tues Oct 23 2001 04:12 pm
Many of you are experts at speaking up for yourselves, isn't it time to move to the next level?
To be offended when others shows signs of undervaluing you is to grant those others a lot of power over you, you are at effect. A desire then follows that you must assert yourself in some way, you need to feel at cause.
Two questions. Are those others seeing you through their own weird ideas about you? If that is the case here is a chance to really laugh out loud or maybe feel compassion. Why do you value them so much that their esteem of you is your measurement of your self esteem?
Author: Worsel
Posted: Tues Oct 23 2001 04:41 pm
Hi flowrite
I don't happen to think anybody can actually undervalue anybody else unless the other anybody agrees with the anybody attempting to undervalue. I hate to say it, but it is kindergarten simple - "sticks and stones may break my bones, but words can never hurt me."
It's just both sides of the same coin for one to seek to undervalue or feel that they MUST attack another, and the other to feel undervalued or that they MUST respond to the attempt at same.
Create-create-create is vastly (no pun intended) superior to counter-create.
.
Author: Robin
Posted: Tues Oct 23 2001 04:42 pm
Hi flowrite
I was thinking this same thing to myself...Then I decided that since the universe we live in is a GAME, these people who are speaking up for themselves must just be enjoying the GAME of it...and I'm assuming they are not taking all this bantering back and forth too seriously.
And speaking of the next level, what would the next level be? I sure would like to be involved with that!!!
Author: Bud
Posted: Tues Oct 23 2001 06:39 pm
To flowrite:
Swami Vivekananda¡¦s famous "passion of sacrifice and renunciation" resounds with the affirmation "Thou art That" at every line, and summons us to our divine Destiny.
In the summer of 1895, Swami Vivekananda spent seven weeks in retreat at Thousand Island Park in upstate New York with a small group of disciples and students, staying in a small cottage belonging to one of them. Some of his teachings from those weeks are recorded in Inspired Talks. Ellen Waldo describes the setting: "There, close by his own door, sat our beloved Teacher every evening during our stay and communed with us who sat silent in the darkness, eagerly drinking in his inspired words. The place was a veritable sanctuary. At our feet, like a sea of green, waved the leaves of the tree tops, for the entire place was surrounded by thick woods. Not one house of the large village could be seen, it was as if we were in the heart of some dense forest, miles away from the haunts of men. Beyond the trees spread the wide expanse of the St. Lawrence, dotted here and there with islands, some of which gleamed bright with the lights of hotels and boarding-houses. All these were so far away that they seemed more like a pictured scene than a reality. Not a human sound penetrated our seclusion; we heard but the murmur of insects, the sweet songs of the birds, or the gentle sighing of the wind through the leaves. Part of the time the scene was illumined by the soft rays of the moon and her face was mirrored in the shining waters beneath. In this scene of enchantment, "the world forgetting, by the world forgot," we spent seven blessed weeks with our beloved Teacher, listening to his words of inspiration.
Mary Funke remembers: "There were twelve of us and it seemed as if Pentecostal fire descended and touched the Master. One afternoon when he had been telling us of the glory of renunciation, of the joy and freedom of those of the ochre robe, he suddenly left us and in a short time he had written his ¡¥Song of the Sannyasin,¡¦ a very passion of sacrifice and renunciation.
* A sannyasin is a monk who has taken the final vows of renunciation according to Hindu rites.
THE SONG OF THE SANNYASIN
Wake up the note! the song that had its birth
Far off, where worldly taint could never reach,
In mountain caves and glades of forest deep,
Whose calm no sigh for lust or wealth or fame
Could ever dare to break; where rolled the stream
Of knowledge, truth, and bliss that follows both.
Sing high that note, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Strike off thy fetters! Bonds that bind thee down,
Of shining gold, or darker, baser ore;
Love, hate¡Xgood, bad¡Xand all the dual throng,
Know, slave is slave, caressed or whipped, not free;
For fetters, though of gold, are not less strong to bind;
Then off with them, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Let darkness go; the will-o¡¦-the-wisp that leads
With blinking light to pile more gloom on gloom.
This thirst for life, for ever quench; it drags
From birth to death, and death to birth, the soul.
He conquers all who conquers self. Know this
And never yield, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
"Who sows must reap," they say, "and cause must bring
The sure effect; good, good; bad, bad; and none
Escape the law. But whoso wears a form
Must wear the chain." Too true; but far beyond
Both name and form is Atman, ever free.
Know thou art That, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om! "
They know not truth who dream such vacant dreams
As father, mother, children, wife, and friend.
The sexless Self! whose father He? whose child?
Whose friend, whose foe is He who is but One?
The Self is all in all, none else exists;
And thou art That, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
There is but One¡XThe Free¡XThe Knower¡XSelf!
Without a name, without a form or stain.
In Him is Maya dreaming all this dream.
The witness, He appears as nature, soul.
Know thou art That, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Where seekest thou? That freedom, friend, this world
Nor that can give. In books and temples vain
Thy search. Thine only is the hand that holds
The rope that drags thee on. Then cease lament,
Let go thy hold, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Say, "Peace to all: From me no danger be
To aught that lives. In those that dwell on high.
In those that lowly creep, I am the Self in all!
All life both here and there, do I renounce,
All heavens and earths and hells, all hopes and fears."
Thus cut thy bonds, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Heed then no more how body lives or goes,
Its task is done. Let Karma float it down;
Let one put garlands on, another kick
This frame; say naught. No praise or blame can be
Where praiser praised, and blamer blamed are one.
Thus be thou calm, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Truth never comes where lust and fame and greed
Of gain reside. No man who thinks of woman
As his wife can ever perfect be;
Nor he who owns the least of things, nor he
Whom anger chains, can ever pass thro¡¦ Maya¡¦s gates.
So, give these up, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Have thou no home. What home can hold thee, friend?
The sky thy roof, the grass thy bed; and food
What chance may bring, well cooked or ill, judge not.
No food or drink can taint that noble Self
Which knows Itself. Like rolling river free
Thou ever be, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Few only know the truth. The rest will hate
And laugh at thee, great one; but pay no heed.
Go thou, the free, from place to place, and help
Them out of darkness, Maya¡¦s veil. Without
The fear of pain or search for pleasure, go
Beyond them both, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Thus, day by day, till Karma¡¦s powers spent
Release the soul for ever. No more is birth,
Nor I, nor thou, nor God, nor man. The "I"
Has All become, the All is "I" and Bliss.
Know thou art That, Sannyasin bold! Say¡X
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Author: Virginia
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 01:18 am
Bud,
Lost me on that one, but then I didn't get to read the whole thing, maybe that's why. I do like reading a lot, so I'll try and get some time to give it my full attention.
But I wanted to say that I appreciate your helping out Flowrite there while some of us are still speaking out about some things.
Like me, for example.
Good thing I don't mind what someone thinks of me for doing so, else I wouldn't have lasted long under heavy personal attacks, such as John's for example.
Nite,
Virginia
Author: Bud
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 04:33 am
I haven't read all of your posts but have formed the opinion that when you responded to criticism you were only trying to help the critic to see what you thought was the truth for their sake, not yours - like when you tried to help John in spite of his abuse of you, for instance. That's not the sort of thing flowrite was talking about or criticising for the sake of others, not hers by the way.
Author: Virginia
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 10:01 am
Bud,
Very astute of you!
And actually, if I have offended Flowrite in some way by my post to you, I will clear that up with her. The part of my post to you concerning speaking up, was also for others, in case others had wanted to interpret flowrite's post in a negative way towards ALL speaking up.
Thank you very much for your reply.
Virginia
Author: Virginia
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 10:07 am
Worsel said:
"Create-create-create is vastly (no pun intended) superior to counter-create."
I would like to add that the ability to do each point at will on the complete cycle of action, is infinitely superior to "fixing" on any one point by itself.
Author: Atman
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 10:36 am
Wow, Bud! What a beautiful poem!
Author: FreeThought^2
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 12:51 pm
Bud,
That was exactly what I HAD THOUGHT of Virginia's criticisms, until I started communicating with her directly instead of as a spectator. Then I found THAT was just a clever appearance.
When you are on the receiving end of one her merciless Black PR tirades, that it is somehow "for your own good" is how she like it viewed by others.
I am actually still a little surprised, what I had believed, what you described, is not true in fact.
I suppose that is the point of learning, to remove our delusions about how things are. So to that I can add that communicating with Virginia ( directly ) has removed some of my delusions ( about her ).
Author: Virginia
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 01:05 pm
UNthought,
The more you talk, the worse you are making it for yourself.
Stop trying to play on the upper boards, 'fore you hurt yourself. (spectatoring for you is safer right now)
Pieces don't fare too well trying to be a player on the upper boards, you got some auditing and training to do before you should try taking that on.
Just a suggestion.
First step, recognize you are BEING played, and are NOT a player.
Hard step, but necessary if you really want to get on the path of spiritual freedom.
However, if you DON'T, then continue deluding yourself as you have been.
Virginia
Author: flowrite
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 04:00 pm
Sorry Bud you lost me on that very long post. I'm not a poem person unless it goes, De dum de dum de dum de dum,
De dum de dum de dum. I must be dumb.
Robin
Healthy banter is great fun but I would say there have been a lot of posts over the last couple of months that were purely, squabbly, petty and defensive. Everyone has a right to defend their ideas, their body, their property, their group and much more. But when it comes to one's own personal feeling of hurt to self how much of that should be seen as case? If you are attacked would it not be better to be like air so that unpleasant comm goes straight through you because there is nothing there to be hurt? You are not identified with your things whatever they are. No ridges resistances for example as these things make you very brittle and anything brittle is easily broken. Yes sure one could still bat off an attack but as a game from a released state, and there would be real choice.
flowrite
Author: Virginia
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 04:35 pm
Flowrite,
What do you think about someone attaining freedom (or wanting to for that matter), and exercising their willingness to pay the price to continue to have that freedom?
Does willing to fight back, and actually fighting back when necessary (pan-determinedly of course towards freedom for the "fightor" and the "fightee"), equal the person has "ridges"?
Myself, I don't think one is necessarily dependent, or caused by the other. Ridges are Ridges.
Virginia
Author: Bud
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 05:12 pm
flowrite, you wrote:
> Sorry Bud you lost me on that very long post. I'm not a
>poem person unless it goes, De dum de dum de dum de dum,
>De dum de dum de dum. I must be dumb.
Your first post reminded me of a few lines in Vivekananda's
"Song of the Sannyasin" that I put in bold print in the
the entire poem that I pasted above. To make it easier for
you, I'll now copy those lines from the above poem and
paste them below:
Let one put garlands on, another kick
This frame; say naught. No praise or blame can be
Where praiser praised, and blamer blamed are one.
Thus be thou calm, Sannyasin bold! Say
"Om Tat Sat, Om!"
Best of luck.
Author: meme
Posted: Wed Oct 24 2001 11:48 pm
Virginia:
Please leave people alone. Stop attacking. Use ARC. You're scaring people off of this board that may have a differing opinion than yours. Like me... I'm not high on the bridge and I guess not that willing to fight back (with you), so I don't post, even though I would like to.
Author: Virginia
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 12:43 am
Meme,
Hey, meme BB, BB meme, that rhymes.
To quote Vast, "Thanks for sharing."
Which "people" exactly should be "left alone'?
And if you are too "scared" to state your opinion, that is somehow my fault?
That's some twisted logic there.
Not to mention you somehow managed to overcome this fear you mention and make a few attacking statements (all done whilst appearing afraid).
Virginia
Author: Rudy
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 07:39 am
meme,
I understand what you are saying and have a few comments and questions for you:
>>>"Please leave people alone.
How is this any better than what you are accusing Virginia of?...enforcement of some sort.
>>>"Stop attacking.
Again, enforcement. Do you call or write TV stations or book publishers if you don't like something they are broadcasting or putting out?
You can discuss the behavior in question or you can ignore it and only read and post to those that have acceptable (to you) messages or behavior. These bulliten boards are a 'selective' method of communicating, and you are a self-determined individual.
>>>"Use ARC.
Look up this word in tech dictionary because you are confusing it with the word affinity which is one of three components of ARC. ARC= understanding. Using ARC doesn't necessarily mean you are 'being nice', it means that you are using the components of the end result. Why don't YOU apply ARC and talk to Virginia if you have a problem. Tell her your viewpoints and be willing to hear hers.
>>>"You're scaring people off of this board that may have a differing opinion than yours. Like me... I'm not high on the bridge and I guess not that willing to fight back (with you), so I don't post, even though I would like to.
Look up the word 'responsibility' in the tech dictionary. Virginia doesn't 'scare' people off of the board. People leave if they don't apply any of the above.
If these things are hard to confront then do some TRs before hand. If you still can't confront them or skip over those you don't want to confront then maybe this environment of mixed viewpoints and methods of communicating them is not for you.
But I hope you stay and play!
Don't be intimidated by Virginia or anyone else. You are welcome here, and if you want to share your viewpoints, great!
Author: Kheinsa
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 10:06 am
Yes, I get put off my the stuff but you know something I learn a thing or two from them.
Some posts are too long and have too many twists for me to follow them but I do pick up a point or two.
I am gaining the ability to notice when someone is playing both sides of the street.
I felt that in my boss and someone who wanted to sell a car. You must learn what is hidden in comm lines.
I was right in both times. I once was so blind I never picked this up. I was slammed against a brick wall in the church because I didn't. Now I just feel it. NO words or motions indicate it to me. I just knew.
So I grant Virgina the ability to know for she is OT.
I am also lower on the grade chart but I am told I am OT. I get a lot of case kicked in. If I don't want to read it I don't. I rather not deal with my case that kicks me. I made my decsion and All I have to do is carry it through now.
I have my write up to do about why I am leaving the church. I am not in doubt any more. I was in doubt about the tech being in the freezone. I checked that too for me. I choose the one's who I hear the most good about.
So even if I am not perfect and I get upset I am trying. I also don't like entheta but that is life on the planet earth. WE have to deal with it. One day when I am an auditor I will choose who I have around me. But I can't change the society as it stands till enough auditors is out there.
So that is life. I don't like it but it is as it is.
Kheinsa
Author: Virginia
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 12:13 pm
Rudy,
I was speechless after reading your post, (well ok, not for LONG lol)
It made my day though.
You go.. boyFRIEND!
(big hug)
Virginia
Author: Virginia
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 12:14 pm
Kheinsa,
Hey! Thank you to you too, I am looking forward to reading your writeup of your story.
Do you have any kind of estimate when you might have that done?
Virginia
Author: Rudy
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 03:33 pm
Virginia,
Yea, well I don't like that blame, shame, and regret stuff.
I am glad you enjoyed my post, I thought you were going to bash me! 
Author: Virginia
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 03:52 pm
Cute Rudy, real cute.
Ha ha ha.
:-)
Virginia
Author: John
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 05:13 pm
As you have predicted, I did run into another individual on another discussion board who gave me just as much trouble (if not more) as Bud or Jeanny, or Virginia. Or for that matter, anyone else whom I claim to be responsible for my problems, but it was my anger.
A short time ago, I realized something about myself; I found that if I just sit and listen, I will be at peace. Anyone who has ever been through bipolar conditions knows that peace is always the furthest thing from you, and many symptoms classify under phsychological method and diagnosis, but the fact that peace is unacheivable remains the anchor which you drag like a ghost, wearing a suit of chains. Medication is not the answer for something as basic and premature as peace.
For some people, like myself, medication is a way to fix what is physically wrong, so that me, the spirit, the soul, the theta being, can acheive rest. This is all a spiritual being wishes, contentment, and that is peace and utter joy. Because we tend to neglect what is physically wrong with the brain, we neglect our mind, and in so doing, us. The body is constructed in the mind, the mapping and mechanistic features can be seen in the brains anatomy. The mind uses the brain to acheive intellectual stimulus with other forms of consciousness, and it can be clearly seen, that there are numerically more functions taking place within the brain than the amount of matter in the known universe. The amount of atomes are speculated to be a hundred times a trillion times a trillion and so on... times the earliest second that we can talk about is a hundredth trillionth of trillionth of a second. So these big IQ guys can do some easy calculations and come up with the number of atoms in the cosmos (Do you believe this is accurate? Me neither 
Anyway, back to the matter at hand. I have resolved my issues with you, the people of fza.org, and even though we had our disagreements, I often found your comments insightful, with a few exceptions. For example; there are a few things about your religion which make me cautious. For starters, I believe I read somewhere that lrh was a student of crowley. OK, and then I read elsewhere that lrh was to young, and that he would have been a kid. For some reason, this never occured to stupid me. However, the "case cracker rundown" is a little ominous when you include it with oto. Now, putting all of that aside, let's assume that there is alien life, intelligent life, and probably in most cases way more intelligent than us. Then we have to assume that your religious philosophy is the correct one, but that is assuming that what you are saying is correct and life is a static.
Well, according to the recent experiment at berkely ca, the universe is flat, therefore neither expanding nor contracting, at least, that's assuming that the calculations are correct, then life creates the universe as a static, but it doesn't conclusively prove that the universe is indeed flat, but it shows some very favorable evidence for the theory. However, there are many mathematicians who do not like these findings, because they condtradict relativity. OK, fine, as you can see, they've got their heads in their ass. Back here in the real world, this means that your theory now has an ace in the hole, because some whiz bang wanna be astronauts back at berkley performed an experiment. Now, the data on this experiment looks good, so let's see how it matches up with your philosophy.
The universe is flat: static
Gravity is the curvature of space: posative interaction of theta communication
The universe is accelerating: time
There is a negative vacuum force,
negative curvature of space (0.1): negative interaction of theta communication
So what we see hear is that communication can be shut down like a computer switch. Communication is best received when it is communicated. I think that makes sense. So what we have here is the question; who is doing the communicating, and who says when the universe has a posative curve (gravity field) and a negative one (fly away). All life of every variety communicates, but no evidence has ever been presented to suggest that the universe can be controlled as an ultimate, none.
In a sense, you could say that our collective consciousness as a species, is part of God, but what is God? First you must answer the question; is there a God?
I have appreciated my time here and am sorry that I wiped my feet everywhere and made a mess, but this discussion board seems to be doing very well, and I take that as meaning I do not belong here. I will hope to see you again, on better terms.
peace out muh bruthas
Author: anonymous
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 05:29 pm
Author: Rudy
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 07:17 pm
Be well John.
Author: Virginia
Posted: Thur Oct 25 2001 11:31 pm
John,
I postulate that you, and your dynamics, will achieve spiritual freedom.
I bid you a successful, and rewarding Journey!
Au Revoir,
Virginia
Author: Kheinsa
Posted: Fri Oct 26 2001 08:17 am
I will start the write-up this weekend.
I have to get my journals out. It will be tough to confront. I still get upset about it when I go near the area.
I am wondering if I should write the story then have a page of comments what should have been done. (In my thoughts.)
I will borrow my father's ethic book and write what I have found according to it.
Yuckers It snowed here. I don't like snow it is too cold.
I will take a bit of time I am a person who writes a lot. virgina you can use it under the name of Kheinsa.
It is also way past time to update my journals on how I found the freezone and what it is.
I never heard of it in the church.
Bye for now.
Kheinsa
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